are we witnessing bo's driver's license moment??

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

yesterday scotus found dc's law prohibiting hand guns to be unconstitutional, and further found that the second amendment is after all an individual right.   bo is on record as supporting the constitutionality of dc's gun law although he now attempts to nuance (all bow to john i fought in vietnam fairy) his position.  bo, a harvard law grad and self-proclaimed constitutional law professor, when discussing the court's ruling is unable to state clearly whether he believes the dc gun law was constitutional or not??   undoubtedly bo will be confronted with questions regarding chicago's similar law presently being challenged by the nra.  of course a cursory examination of his record regarding the rights of gun owners reveals his position to be something along the lines of "the right of the people to dial 911 shall not be infringed."   time is not his ally, as this issue will percolate over the course of the summer. just as mrs bill stammering obfuscation regarding ny state driver's licenses for illegals demonstrated her to be an intellectually average, standard pandering pol, this issue effectively reveals the messiah to have no robe.

[gunit_sangh]

no

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

no

ah, none but i recognized the moment with mrs bill...

[trex]

no

ah, none but i recognized the moment with mrs bill...

Another position that will hurt him amongst gunowners and 2ns amendment proponents. 

[gunit_sangh]

no doubt there are many hunters who have this kind of attitude ... but let's be honest ... they probably fall in the 23% of folks who still approve of georgie's job performance and would rather chop off their arm than vote for a democrat.

But there have been many news reports over the last few years of sportsmen who have become pissed off at the land management policies of dear leader that has destroyed hunting/fishing areas. 

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

gunnit how can continue to present as so obtuse regarding this issue and for that matter every issue.  do you try to be inane, dull, slow, dimly lit.......this is not about hunters, rather it is the fundamental right to bear arms as guaranteed within the constitution.  bo will have difficulty in running away from his position on this issue and it will fit nicely beside his clinging to their guns and religion slur of white, rural america. 

[Vermouth]

Obama is so trying to have it both ways.

"Gun ownership is an individual right but we can restrict it."

It will probably work for him. This evolution of his position doesn't come close to McCain's flip flops.

It's not the same as Hillary's driver's license moment. She flip-flopped in the space of two minutes, panicked, sputtered, and then released a carefully crafted written answer a week later.

[Vermouth]

It was Tim Russert who asked Hillary Clinton that question at the Philidelphia debate on October 30, 2007.

- - - - - - - - - -

MR. RUSSERT: Senator Clinton, Governor of New York Eliot Spitzer has proposed giving driver's licenses to illegal immigrants. You told the Nashua, New Hampshire editorial board it makes a lot of sense. Why does it make a lot of sense to give an illegal immigrant a driver's license?

SEN. CLINTON: Well, what Governor Spitzer is trying to do is fill the vacuum left by the failure of this administration to bring about comprehensive immigration reform. We know in New York we have several million at any one time who are in New York illegally. They are undocumented workers. They are driving on our roads. The possibility of them having an accident that harms themselves or others is just a matter of the odds. It's probability. So what Governor Spitzer is trying to do is to fill the vacuum.

I believe we need to get back to comprehensive immigration reform because no state, no matter how well-intentioned, can fill this gap.

There needs to be federal action on immigration reform.

MR. RUSSERT: Does anyone here believe an illegal immigrant should not have a driver's license?

REP. KUCINICH: Believe what?

MR. RUSSERT: An illegal immigrant should not have a driver's license.

SEN. DODD: This is a privilege. And look, I'm as forthright and progressive on immigration policy as anyone here, but we're dealing with a serious problem here, we need to have people come forward. The idea that we're going to extend this privilege here of a driver's license, I think, is troublesome. And I think the American people are reacting to it.

We need to deal with security on our borders, we need to deal with the attraction that draws people here, we need to deal fairly with those who are here; but this is a privilege. Talk about health care, I have a different opinion. That affects the public health of all of us. But a license is a privilege, and that ought not to be extended, in my view.

MR. WILLIAMS: Who else? Senator --

SEN. CLINTON: I just want to add, I did not say that it should be done, but I certainly recognize why Governor Spitzer is trying to do it. And we have failed --

SEN. DODD: Wait a minute. No, no, no. You said yes, you thought it made sense to do it.

SEN. CLINTON: No, I didn't, Chris. But the point is, what are we going to do with all these illegal immigrants who are (driving ?) -- (inaudible)?

SEN. DODD: Well, that's a legitimate issue. But driver's license goes too far, in my view.

SEN. CLINTON: Well, you may say that, but what is the identification if somebody runs into you today who is an undocumented worker --

SEN. DODD: There's ways of dealing with that.

SEN. CLINTON: Well, but --

SEN. DODD: This is a privilege, not a right.

SEN. CLINTON: Well, what Governor Spitzer has agreed to do is to have three different licenses; one that provides identification for actually going onto airplanes and other kinds of security issues, another which is an ordinary driver's license, and then a special card that identifies the people who would be on the road.

SEN. DODD: That's a bureaucratic nightmare.

SEN. CLINTON: So it's not the full privilege.

MR. RUSSERT: Senator Clinton, I just want to make sure what I heard. Do you, the New York Senator Hillary Clinton, support the New York governor's plan to give illegal immigrants a driver's license? You told the Nashua, New Hampshire, paper it made a lot of sense.

SEN. CLINTON: It --

MR. RUSSERT: Do you support his plan?

SEN. CLINTON: You know, Tim, this is where everybody plays gotcha. It makes a lot of sense. What is the governor supposed to do? He is dealing with a serious problem. We have failed, and George Bush has failed.

Do I think this is the best thing for any governor to do? No. But do I understand the sense of real desperation, trying to get a handle on this? Remember, in New York we want to know who's in New York. We want people to come out of the shadows. He's making an honest effort to do it. We should have passed immigration reform.

- - - - - - - - - -

John Edwards got his dig in a few minutes later:

MR. EDWARDS: I want to add something that Chris Dodd just said a minute ago, because I don't want it to go unnoticed. Unless I missed something, Senator Clinton said two different things in the course of about two minutes just a few minutes ago, and I think this is a real issue for the country.

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

Obama is so trying to have it both ways.

"Gun ownership is an individual right but we can restrict it."

It will probably work for him. This evolution of his position doesn't come close to McCain's flip flops.

It's not the same as Hillary's driver's license moment. She flip-flopped in the space of two minutes, panicked, sputtered, and then released a carefully crafted written answer a week later.

vermouth, bo is absolutely correct in acknowledging that a. gun ownership is an individual right and b. the govt can reasonably restrict that or any right.  is there a compelling govt interest in restricting the right that out weighs the unrestricted rights of the individual??  the problem for bo is that he is on record as supporting dc's law and chicago's as well.  he is clearly in a conundrum.  if little mac is smart he will constantly be asking whether bo supports the dc law and if not why did he in the very recent past?  like mrs bill, bo is trying not to straddle the fence but to be on both sides of the fence at the same time.

[Scaybeeez]

the problem for bo is that he is on record as supporting dc's law and chicago's as well.  he is clearly in a conundrum.  if little mac is smart he will constantly be asking whether bo supports the dc law and if not why did he in the very recent past?  like mrs bill, bo is trying not to straddle the fence but to be on both sides of the fence at the same time.

I don't particularly see how this is a problem for Obama.  For decades, that was the understood reality of gun laws in America, so what's controversial about his agreement with it at the time?  So long as he abides by this new Supreme Court ruling, no biggie.

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

the problem for bo is that he is on record as supporting dc's law and chicago's as well.  he is clearly in a conundrum.  if little mac is smart he will constantly be asking whether bo supports the dc law and if not why did he in the very recent past?  like mrs bill, bo is trying not to straddle the fence but to be on both sides of the fence at the same time.

I don't particularly see how this is a problem for Obama.  For decades, that was the understood reality of gun laws in America, so what's controversial about his agreement with it at the time?  So long as he abides by this new Supreme Court ruling, no biggie.

are you attempting to make a point??   

[Scaybeeez]

are you attempting to make a point??   

Aside from pointing out that what you've somehow convinced yourself is a scandal is actually no issue at all? 

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

scandal is inappropriate and it is your word not mine.  again are you attempting to make a point?

[gorknoids]

no doubt there are many hunters who have this kind of attitude ... but let's be honest ... they probably fall in the 23% of folks who still approve of georgie's job performance and would rather chop off their arm than vote for a democrat.

But there have been many news reports over the last few years of sportsmen who have become pissed off at the land management policies of dear leader that has destroyed hunting/fishing areas. 

gunit, you clearly aren't aware that anyone without a felony conviction in most states have the same right to wear a handgun on their hip as the police do.  I can legally walk through any mall, hospital, or sporting venue wearing my handgun on my hip.  It isn't about classifications of gun owners, it's about the constitution. 
     And now to get all up in your grill........:  Post one story about sportsmen who have become pissed off at anything President Bush has signed WRT land management.  Cutting menhaden harvesting by the dog food companies sure as hell didn't bother me or my fishing buddies.  His legislation regarding striped bass protection was a God-send for those of us who funded it ( Sportsmen have traditionally paid their way when it comes to such things through licenses and permits.  I feel safe when I say that I have done more for the welfare of our finned and feathered friends than Obama could ever do.)
     But back to the RIGHT to bear arms.  It's right there beside the right to free speech. 

[trex]

the problem for bo is that he is on record as supporting dc's law and chicago's as well.  he is clearly in a conundrum.  if little mac is smart he will constantly be asking whether bo supports the dc law and if not why did he in the very recent past?  like mrs bill, bo is trying not to straddle the fence but to be on both sides of the fence at the same time.

I don't particularly see how this is a problem for Obama.  For decades, that was the understood reality of gun laws in America, so what's controversial about his agreement with it at the time?  So long as he abides by this new Supreme Court ruling, no biggie.

Of course you dont see a problem...I wonder why?  Political blindness perhaps?  Obama wasnt even originally intended to run for the Democratic nomination...he was an after thought.... Law abiding Americans want thier 2nd amendment rights to shot down the criminals who break into our homes and threaten our families and threaten public safety.

Obama will continue to alienate himself because his tight rope walk will get real tough around September when the rest of the s*#t comes out...when the bag is emptied.....besides he is not experienced enough to be president. Hes just a slick talking con man.