Mandatory health care???

[Peter1469]

For those government fetishists who cannot wait for universal health care….

Massachusetts chose to create universal care by ordering all citizens to obtain health insurance

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/05/us/05doctors.html?ei=5087&em=&en=7e890db1d78a1061&ex=1207627200&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1207487162-WudxMRRadqQVBl2gDvKnqQ

In pockets of the United States, rural and urban, a confluence of market and medical forces has been widening the gap between the supply of primary care physicians and the demand for their services. Modest pay, medical school debt, an aging population and the prevalence of chronic disease have each played a role.
Now in Massachusetts, in an unintended consequence of universal coverage, the imbalance is being exacerbated by the state’s new law requiring residents to have health insurance.
Since last year, when the landmark law took effect, about 340,000 of Massachusetts’ estimated 600,000 uninsured have gained coverage. Many are now searching for doctors and scheduling appointments for long-deferred care.

Move to Massachusetts and leave the rest of us alone. 

[SDML]

I have a brother who lives in Boston. He now hates Romney.

The fine, by the way, for not having insurance is 50% of the cost of said insurance - paid to the state.

[Peter1469]

Next the government will force doctors to practice primary care so that all of these universally covered citizens can see a doctor. 

I wonder if VA coverage would count as insurance.  I used that excuse in law school (insurance was mandatory) and saved lots of money in health insurance.  Never went to the doctor one. 

[wow]

Next the government will force doctors to practice primary care so that all of these universally covered citizens can see a doctor. 

I wonder if VA coverage would count as insurance.  I used that excuse in law school (insurance was mandatory) and saved lots of money in health insurance.  Never went to the doctor one. 

That sounds like a mess.
Politicians in France and the UK admit they using long waiting lines for treatment as a means of controlling costs.
The UK recently raised taxes on the poor and middle-class to cover the increased costs of rationed medical care.
 

[Vermouth]

Hopefully we can learn from Massachussetts before experimenting at the national level.

[jkoffan]

Knowing what I know, mandatory universal health care in the United States is ludicrous.
The quality of health care will become worse than it currently is.
A few days ago, I met a Canadian visitng the United States.
I asked him about the health care in Canada. He said people
had to wait for 6-12 hours before seeing a doctor for non-
emergency medical care which I assume to be unscheduled
medical visits. He also said people needing non-emergency surgeries would have to wait from 1- 1 1/2 years.
Just think with all the people there are in the United States
how long you would have to wait for medical treatment, ha ha!
Also, according to my medical source, the cost of universal health care in the United States based on a population of 300 million at
an annual average of $6,000 per person would be
$1,800,000,000,000, almost two trillion dollars annually.
I wonder where the money is coming from? 
 

[spunkloaf]

Hopefully we can learn from Massachussetts before experimenting at the national level.

Very good point.
I also wonder if this particular universal plan was ill-conceived to scare people, and confuse them about what universal coverage really is.  Either way, it should not have been conducted in this forceful manner.

[Vermouth]

Or we could try the lottery like Oregon.

In what is believed to be the first such move, a US state is running a lottery in which the prize is health insurance: Oregon's Healthcare Lottery

[jkoffan]

Mandatory universal health care is unconstitutional. I was told
if a person does not sign up, they will be fined, illegal to do.
It violates a person's right to make a choice in how
they will receive their healthcare.
Voters should think about this and challenge any candidate
who stands for mandatory universal healthcare.
Under a universal healthcare system, a patient cannot sue for medical mal-practice.

[pittypat65]

I spoke with a man from Regina Canada yesterday. He says Canadians make fun of our government. He said over 90% of Canadians are very happy with their health plans. The healthcare decisions are made by the doctors and not insurance companies. Everyone there has healthcare whether they work or not. Why can't we? I don't care about myself as I have excellent insurance, no hmo, but millions do not. I would gladly pay more taxes if it was for a national healthcare plan. FOR EVERYONE!! And thats my Liberal side. 

[Gunit Hussein Sangh]

here's where pittypat and I can agree on -- but this will never be achieved with mcbush in office (sorry couldn't help myself  ) Both sides take extreme cases to prove their point about how good/bad something is. But gosh ... haven't ya'll gotten sick, called the doctor or dentist and said they were booked solid. If they could work you in, you might have to wait a few hours or maybe have to wait until the next day to see the doctor.

A few years ago I had a minor skin condition that required me to go to a dermatologist. The first appointment they worked me in late morning and I waited almost 2 hours to see her. For the 2nd appointment, I made it for 10am (a month out). It took two & 1/2 hours before I saw her. The 3rd appointment I thought I would be smart and made it for 9am (once again a month out) ... and it still took 2 hours to see her (she was seriously overbooking her appointments obviously -- I never went back to her after she made a comment that I had a stress issue after complaining about the lengthy waits in her waiting room).

Now this is proof positive that the health care system in the US sucks doesn't it??? cuz this system required me to wait!
 
The horrors of it all

and yes I'm being a bit snarky here

[wow]

I spoke with a man from Regina Canada yesterday. He says Canadians make fun of our government. He said over 90% of Canadians are very happy with their health plans. The healthcare decisions are made by the doctors and not insurance companies. Everyone there has healthcare whether they work or not. Why can't we? I don't care about myself as I have excellent insurance, no hmo, but millions do not. I would gladly pay more taxes if it was for a national healthcare plan. FOR EVERYONE!! And thats my Liberal side. 

From what I have read, 42 million out of the 48 million uninsured qualify for health Insurance, but choose not to pay for it or sign up for it.
The remaining 6 million live in a states that does not provide pool coverage for those that can not get health Insurance elsewhere.
The healthcare problem is minor, excluding the costs of health Insurance.
The cost of health Insurance can be cut in half if there was tort reform for malpractice lawsuits.
Exclude Lawyers/Politicians from the healthcare equation and Americans will continue to have the best and cheapest healthcare in the world.
 

[wow]

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080407/lieberman

The Massachusetts plan, passed in 2006 with the support of then-Governor Mitt Romney, is stumbling financially because far more people need help than Romney originally estimated; the state now believes there may be as many as 650,000 uninsured, not 400,000. And there's a shortfall in funds to cover the subsidies those people have been promised. The uninsured have come out of the proverbial woodwork to buy insurance rather than face tax penalties, and since many of them cannot afford coverage, the state is on the hook for their premiums. "Romney won acceptability by obscuring how much money is really needed in the absence of genuine cost controls," says Boston University professor Alan Sager, who specializes in healthcare costs.

Massachusetts had budgeted $472 million for the current fiscal year, but it needs an additional appropriation of $150 million, which will come out of the public purse. Next year could be bad too. When the law was passed, a legislative conference committee projected that $725 million would be needed for subsidies in the third year. Now it looks like the program will need $869 million to cover premiums for those who can't afford them. "I wouldn't characterize the situation as dire," says Jon Kingsdale, chief executive of the Commonwealth Health Insurance Connector Authority, which administers the program. "The affordability issue has always been there." Just last Thursday Leslie Kirwan, state budget director and chair of the authority, said the program next year will cost "significantly" more than $869 million. Money counted on by the law's architects has not materialized. Lawmakers had counted on getting about $500 million to $600 million from the state's free-care pool, which paid hospitals to treat the poor. The theory was that more insured residents would mean less need for free care. But apparently people are still uninsured and need care, so that money is not available. And assessments from employers are not adequate either. Instead of requiring them to cover their workers, the law allows employers to pay $295 per employee per year to help cover the uninsured. The sum was a compromise to keep employers from fighting a mandate that would have required them to spend upwards of $9,000 a year on real insurance for each employee. The state has collected only $6 million so far. One reason: before he left office, Romney changed the rules so fewer employers would be subject to penalties.

[pittypat65]

Does anyone realize what the cost of not having a health insurance plan costs you the taxpayer? Medicaid? Emergency rooms overflowing with uninsureds. No preventive care so we wind up paying more in the end in medicare for those who cannot afford insurance. My neighbour across the street has throat cancer. It was over 6 months before he received any specialty treatment. He has what they call the Nevada Death Plan. An HMO which very few doctors will take and there are many of these HMOs. He had to go to Arizona to get trreatment and there is much more. These insurance companies fight tooth and nail not to pay and if you have a preexisting condition you cant even buy it . You would not believe some of the horrible stories my daughter tells me. She comes home depressed nearly everyday due to the sad things she sees on a dailey basis as an emergency room RN. Its very sad.  What if it were your mother or someone you love who could not get decent healthcare?

[pittypat65]

The healthcare system or lack of it I might say is a dirty little secret the insurance companies try to keep but its all coming out. Hillary is right on with her plan. Now McCain needs to get with it.  I think he will when elected. Its a hard fight though.