A verdict is close

[Vermouth]

I agree with the defense attorney on this.

Mr. Swift, a former Navy lawyer, argued that a sentence in proportion to Mr. Hamdan’s participation as a driver would help make meaningful some future verdict against the planners of the 2001 terror attacks.

“At some point,” he said, “we will bring the people who conspired, the people who brought those buildings down, and that’s going to be a great day.”

Mr. Swift said that a sentence that is modest by comparison to a potential sentence against the Sept. 11 plotters would help give that eventual sentence its proper significance. “And it will be all the more meaningful because we got the guys who did it, not the driver.”

I guess Hamdan will be in prison for life because we will fight the "war on terror" indefinitely.

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

this mother fucker was aiding and abetting a terrorist and mass murderer because it was the best job in town!  this cocksucker should be dead in a ditch with a made in usa bullet in his head.  the problem was the prosecutions inability to prove conspiracy.  i just drove the guy about, he did not consult me for advice regarding the best way to kill americans.  we clearly have lost our will to survive.

[Michael Aldrich]

this mother fucker was aiding and abetting a terrorist and mass murderer because it was the best job in town!  this cocksucker should be dead in a ditch with a made in usa bullet in his head.  the problem was the prosecutions inability to prove conspiracy.  i just drove the guy about, he did not consult me for advice regarding the best way to kill americans.  we clearly have lost our will to survive.

Just imagine how things will be when Obama becomes president.

[gorknoids]

And you thought the South Park video was funny!!

[Peter1469]

this mother fucker was aiding and abetting a terrorist and mass murderer because it was the best job in town!  this cocksucker should be dead in a ditch with a made in usa bullet in his head.  the problem was the prosecutions inability to prove conspiracy.  i just drove the guy about, he did not consult me for advice regarding the best way to kill americans.  we clearly have lost our will to survive.

It would have been nice were he killed before capture, although I think that I saw somewhere that this guy was turned in by bounty-hunters (or unhappy neighbors).  But I will not second guess the sentence without seeing the evidence that was admitted as evidence of his guilt.  If he was a small-bit terror player, then I have no problem with the sentence.  With that said, Hamdan needs to start a letter writing campaign to OBL asking them to end hostilities with the West- because he is still a prisoner of war and can be held until the end of these current hostilities- short of a prisoner exchange. 

[gorknoids]

Well, he's undoubtedly on video, in stills, and has been tied 56 different ways as Osama's bodyguard.

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

this mother fucker was aiding and abetting a terrorist and mass murderer because it was the best job in town!  this cocksucker should be dead in a ditch with a made in usa bullet in his head.  the problem was the prosecutions inability to prove conspiracy.  i just drove the guy about, he did not consult me for advice regarding the best way to kill americans.  we clearly have lost our will to survive.

It would have been nice were he killed before capture, although I think that I saw somewhere that this guy was turned in by bounty-hunters (or unhappy neighbors).  But I will not second guess the sentence without seeing the evidence that was admitted as evidence of his guilt.  If he was a small-bit terror player, then I have no problem with the sentence.  With that said, Hamdan needs to start a letter writing campaign to OBL asking them to end hostilities with the West- because he is still a prisoner of war and can be held until the end of these current hostilities- short of a prisoner exchange. 

i for one have a huge problem with it.  hamdan is not a pow and is not entitled to any of the protections of the geneva convention.  what he is entitled to is a thorough interrogation to be followed by a swift and sure execution.

[conley]

i see what you did here

 

[Peter1469]

this mother fucker was aiding and abetting a terrorist and mass murderer because it was the best job in town!  this cocksucker should be dead in a ditch with a made in usa bullet in his head.  the problem was the prosecutions inability to prove conspiracy.  i just drove the guy about, he did not consult me for advice regarding the best way to kill americans.  we clearly have lost our will to survive.

It would have been nice were he killed before capture, although I think that I saw somewhere that this guy was turned in by bounty-hunters (or unhappy neighbors).  But I will not second guess the sentence without seeing the evidence that was admitted as evidence of his guilt.  If he was a small-bit terror player, then I have no problem with the sentence.  With that said, Hamdan needs to start a letter writing campaign to OBL asking them to end hostilities with the West- because he is still a prisoner of war and can be held until the end of these current hostilities- short of a prisoner exchange. 

i for one have a huge problem with it.  hamdan is not a pow and is not entitled to any of the protections of the geneva convention.  what he is entitled to is a thorough interrogation to be followed by a swift and sure execution.

I agree that he is not a POW under the Geneva definition since he is not a legal combatant- I was not precise in the use of the English language.  And if our standard is going to be that all illegal combatants get death if convicted, that is fine too.  However, if we are going to give reasonable sentences (based upon our standards in normal courts-martial) then if this guy was a small-fire then his sentence may have been appropriate.  Neither I nor you have seen the evidence that was admitted in the trial.  It is possible that as a body guard for OBL, he killed nobody.  We don’t know.

Just to clarify my initial point- I wasn’t that surprised by the sentence – in my 22 months of experience as a military prosecutor I typically saw light sentences being handed down in military courts.  Unless you committed a violent rape, murder, or assault on a child sentences tended to be lighter than what you would expect.  Which didn’t really bother me at all.  If I were a military judge I would ask to see the enlistment contract.  “It looks like you signed your name on this here paper to serve honorably for 4 years!!  Well you dumb fucker- I don’t give a crap if it takes you 20 years, you are going to give at least 4 honorable years before you are discharged.  Think about that while you serve your jail time and make better decisions when you get back to a real unit.”  Sorry for the aside- that applies to military criminals not terrorists. 

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

he is in the employment of the enemy.  therefore he is the enemy.  we kill the enemy.  simple, uncomplicated.

[Peter1469]

he is in the employment of the enemy.  therefore he is the enemy.  we kill the enemy.  simple, uncomplicated.

Got it- very simple.  I wish the killing took place before the judicial system, albeit military, took over the matter. 

[they call me MR. GRUMPY god damn it!]

i do too.

[Gunit Hussein Sangh]

Peter, a word of advice my friend ...

Arguing concepts of justice with Grumpy is like pissing in the wind.